tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5729738823205484539.post978096316235828974..comments2022-03-27T03:13:17.517-06:00Comments on A Voice In The Desert: The Minefield of Mental Illness and the ChurchJeannette Alteshttp://www.blogger.com/profile/06574051760314762024noreply@blogger.comBlogger22125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5729738823205484539.post-10317110683271387112013-05-03T22:19:28.859-06:002013-05-03T22:19:28.859-06:00Hi, Jessy. Thanks for stopping bt.
You're rig...Hi, Jessy. Thanks for stopping bt.<br /><br />You're right. Although we have, in general, come a ways from the days (just a few short decades ago) of shock therapy and lobotomies. there is still a lot of fear and ignorance (which go hand in hand).Jeannette Alteshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06574051760314762024noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5729738823205484539.post-60233999984062730382013-05-03T11:58:26.057-06:002013-05-03T11:58:26.057-06:00The community has truly failed itself at the menta...The community has truly failed itself at the mental health treatment levelJessyhttp://lifescapesolutions.com/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5729738823205484539.post-57006378439256962172012-07-07T22:11:13.803-06:002012-07-07T22:11:13.803-06:00Jimmy, (sorry for the typo on your name earlier)
...Jimmy, (sorry for the typo on your name earlier)<br /><br />That's a big question with no easy answer. It is still a work in progress. <br /><br />One of the biggest things, I think, was reaching the place of allowing myself to doubt and question what I had been taught in church. I began tearing things apart a looking at them - still do as needed - and then just time - to process, to challenge - time alone with Him. <br /><br />And finally, having people around me who were not afraid to let me question, let me feel the pain and just sit with me as I worked through it. That is still in progress, too. <br /><br />One of the biggest things was letting go of the notion that we can figure God out and understand and define Him. We can't. He is way more than we can wrap our minds around. So....any man's definition is incomplete. And anyone who insists that they have the lock on who and what God is all about is lying or deluded or immature. <br />Ha, and that's the short version.Jeannette Alteshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06574051760314762024noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5729738823205484539.post-61682218008321096862012-07-07T19:53:36.358-06:002012-07-07T19:53:36.358-06:00Jeanette,I certainly believe you're right abou...Jeanette,I certainly believe you're right about God, He was with you the whole time and He never desires evil; what did it take for you to reach that understanding? I assume it didn't come easily.James "Jimmy" Brownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05816975290475391607noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5729738823205484539.post-88777687688123955722012-07-07T18:22:53.444-06:002012-07-07T18:22:53.444-06:00Hi Jummy,
The problem of pain is a central issue....Hi Jummy,<br /><br />The problem of pain is a central issue. Believe me, I have yelled at God and told Him off...and come to realize that a lot of what I was taught about him was, well, just not accurate. <br /><br />Hmm...if he intervened to prevent every evil act, then we would all be robots devoid of free will. There is an exchange from the TV show "Saving Grace" that I like (paraphrasing): <br /><br />GRACE (To her Guardian Angel): Earl, ask God why that bastard killed all those women.<br />EARL: Don't ask God, ask the killer. <br /><br />Yes, God allows this stuff to happen, but not because He endorses it of likes it or is indifferent. The alternative - total restraint (or destruction) of all humanity..... <br /><br />I don't pretend to understand it all - and I went through a period where I asked God why the hell... but I have found peace with the knowing that He didn't want it and he was actually there with me the whole time....Jeannette Alteshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06574051760314762024noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5729738823205484539.post-37165369639885492922012-07-07T14:32:55.507-06:002012-07-07T14:32:55.507-06:00The problems of pain; it has always had my attenti...The problems of pain; it has always had my attention. I'm quite sure it will continue to exist through-out the remaining history of mankind. <br />You don't seem bitter with God; how so?James "Jimmy" Brownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05816975290475391607noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5729738823205484539.post-25829497159248026732012-07-02T17:54:37.477-06:002012-07-02T17:54:37.477-06:00Hey, HUG, thanks for dropping by!
Yes, it is very...Hey, HUG, thanks for dropping by!<br /><br />Yes, it is very convenient. Unfortunately, even well-meaning naive followers call buy this - it really feeds a fear mentality. It seems to cycle through every couple of decades. Sigh.Jeannette Alteshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06574051760314762024noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5729738823205484539.post-1299170728392979092012-07-02T10:20:53.995-06:002012-07-02T10:20:53.995-06:00The description that was given of how to recognize...<i>The description that was given of how to recognize someone who had fallen away from faith and was in the hands of demonic forces and needed intervention was identical to the list of symptoms of someone who is coming out of a cultish religiously abusive situation - reverting to old behaviors, cussing, not reading the Bible anymore...</i><br /><br />Convenient, that. Especially for the "cultish religiously-abusive situation" -- any symptom of recovery is due to DEMONS(TM) and becomes SAY-TANN-IC (TM). And the cure is to be "Saved", i.e. pulled back into the cultish abusive group. VERY convenient.<br /><br />If it fits the usual pattern, the definition of symptoms is probably so vague you could accuse anybody of having them. I saw something similar during the Satanic Panic of the Eighties, where any normal adolescent behavior (i.e. testing the limits and finding a separate identity from that of "Mom & Dad's little kid) was PROOF (TM) of Dungeons & Dragons and The Occult (TM) and SATANISM(TM).<br /><br />Headless Unicorn GuyAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5729738823205484539.post-47446965544291513682012-06-23T04:20:50.065-06:002012-06-23T04:20:50.065-06:00Anonymous -
Thank you for the recommendation...an...Anonymous - <br />Thank you for the recommendation...and you are welcome.Jeannette Alteshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06574051760314762024noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5729738823205484539.post-90390074681936305142012-06-22T22:44:40.715-06:002012-06-22T22:44:40.715-06:00Have you read the writings of Waneta Dawn? She ha...Have you read the writings of Waneta Dawn? She has a book and a website. She was raised in a very strict religion (Mennonite). If you have the time, read her articles on "Submission Tyranny, in Church and Society <br />The Belief That Begets Domestic Violence." She has a part 1 and part 2 titled "Churches Mocking God?"<br /><br />Like you, I have come to see the abuse and the severity of my childhood abuse, decades later. She is very kind and eloquent in her writings and you can be rest assured that the wisdom from whence they came was after much abuse and searching of the scriptures. I'm grateful for others who share thier hearts and minds. Thank you.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5729738823205484539.post-84017213680261760412012-06-10T20:45:11.119-06:002012-06-10T20:45:11.119-06:00JERB -
Detoxifying is a good word for it. For me, ...JERB -<br />Detoxifying is a good word for it. For me, part of that including putting the Bible down until the toxic way it was used on me was cleansed enough that I could read it and hear Truth instead of twisted manipulation.<br /><br />Thank you for your kind words. May you continue to find Truth and Freedom.Jeannette Alteshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06574051760314762024noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5729738823205484539.post-58495268114736837122012-06-10T00:34:09.970-06:002012-06-10T00:34:09.970-06:00As I have been detoxifying from religion and spiri...As I have been detoxifying from religion and spiritual abuse the past four years, Abba has allowed me and I'm going to say, He has even led me to put the Bible down. I have been learning He has been teaching me He loves me and is with me wether I read the Bible or not. Now it's getting clearer and clearer to why I would feel Abba was keeping me from my "prayer closet". He was cleansing all the crap out of my system. I would go for months with out cracking the Bible or writing in my journals, then I would return to these things and swear I had fallen into depression again, because I had allowed myself to go dry by not reading God's word or spending time with Him. At the contrary, I now understand He was and is always by my side the only thing making me feel like hell on earth was the stupid lies ruling and lurking in my mind. <br />You write so eloquently and it brings me freedom. Thank you. I never, ever thought Abba would use a blog to bring me healing. You are in my heart. Even though our stories are not identical , it seems our character is very similar and I can relate to you in many ways. Thank you.J.E.R.B.https://www.blogger.com/profile/07500369864712983520noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5729738823205484539.post-81400614856064660882012-06-06T17:55:29.499-06:002012-06-06T17:55:29.499-06:00Anonymous June 5, 2012 6:38 PM -
Thanks for stopp...Anonymous June 5, 2012 6:38 PM -<br /><br />Thanks for stopping by. I do think the 'church system' as we know it attracts narcissists and abusers. And they will throw the blame for issues that come on any target to which they can get it to stick....<br /><br />Anonymous June 5, 2012 7:32 PM -<br /><br />Thanks for stopping by.<br />Hmmm....I guess it depends on your definition. To me, mental illness is any condition that interferes with your ability to function 'normally' or in a healthy way. <br /><br />I know the term 'mental illness' has a lot of negative connotation - especially in the church culture. I'm not using the church's definition of the term. PTSD is a mental condition that classifies as illness. It can be treated and recovered from, like physical illnesses. That's where I'm coming from, anyway.Jeannette Alteshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06574051760314762024noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5729738823205484539.post-5028996534969814332012-06-05T19:32:13.154-06:002012-06-05T19:32:13.154-06:00Jeanette, The Post tramatic Stress comes from hav...Jeanette, The Post tramatic Stress comes from having major trauma in ones life. I can relate. I personaly don't believe that it is mental illness. Also, who wouldn't be depressed growing up in an inviroment like we did. They brainwash you,abuse you and screw with your mind. And then you go to church and deal with the same bs. That takes a toll on a person. They are the ones who are screwed up, not us.<br /><br />A lot of what is called mental illness by people today(and counselers) is just part of the human condition. I don't know if you heard this recently but now the want to call grief a mental illness.<br /><br />I think that true mental illness is: one example, someone hears voices and sees things that are not there.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5729738823205484539.post-52142675046156702312012-06-05T18:38:20.513-06:002012-06-05T18:38:20.513-06:00Jeanette, You are someone who I can relate to. Gre...Jeanette, You are someone who I can relate to. Grew up with nfoo and then delt with many narcs in the church. It's unfortunate but the "church" today is full of them(I'd say at least 85-90%).They are always excused for their narcissitic behavior.Never held accountable with their abuses and their crappy behavior towards others. If you have a problem with them, than it is your problem, not theirs.They always have to have a scapegoat. Whether it is in a family or a church. Yep, I was the scapegoat.Still am with foo.<br /><br />Scripture doesn't say that the majority will make it into the kingdom but a few.<br /><br /> I just wanted to let you know that I can relate.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5729738823205484539.post-19097124615751812322012-04-10T20:13:20.303-06:002012-04-10T20:13:20.303-06:00Hey,Tim - thanks. :-)
Brenda,
Thanks for stopping...Hey,Tim - thanks. :-)<br /><br />Brenda,<br />Thanks for stopping by. And yes, I have found that to be true.Jeannette Alteshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06574051760314762024noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5729738823205484539.post-37636911901972922922012-04-10T05:02:02.760-06:002012-04-10T05:02:02.760-06:00Hi Jeannette,
I have just read your post and one t...Hi Jeannette,<br />I have just read your post and one thing really stood out to me. You always turned to God for help when others tried to 'be God'. I have noticed that there can be sometimes very little of God's love in Christians. It may ve that you do not want to open the Bible because of your bad experiences with Christians and their interpretation of the scriptures, I don't know, but I can tell you that if you seek God for yourself He is the most loving, patient, comforting and understanding being there could possibly be, and He wants only peace for us. Jesus said 'In the world you have tribulation, in me you have peace' Jesus is the word of God so I would think you will be able to judge whether or not someone is speaking God's word to you by this plumbline. God bless you and bring you total peace in Jesus.<br />BrendaBrendahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16165344093549650260noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5729738823205484539.post-81104973007070149422012-03-28T08:07:41.404-06:002012-03-28T08:07:41.404-06:00Hi Jeannette; You wrote: ""This is not w...Hi Jeannette; You wrote: ""This is not what he said and not what he did!!!! What the hell are you doing?!"" Sometimes, wouldn't it be nice if we could just be honest, even if that gets us a little angry! So much truth is hidden behind us being 'nice' and being scared of seeming weird, and so on. When Jesus threw the moneychangers out of the temple, I suspect He was letting off steam too!<br /><br />There's a story in a book I've reviewed called 'Cut to The Chase' by two British Christian authors, who are not your atypical rather nice rather Middle Class Christians we expect of England! They are regular guys as you might say, normal blokes who are Christians. Anyway, they mention a story about a guy, very much a Christian, working with tough guys who were not Christians, who kept taunting him and picking on him, until he attacked one of them with a cricket bat! I don't recommend this type of action at all, but after this, all the other guys started respecting him! Sometimes, we need to be blunt and honest, to open up much needed dialogue, often wth people who are hurting in some way. I don't want to hide behind religious platitudes, I want to live in the full light of what Jesus wants me to be, irrespective of what religious people might think or say. You go girl!T-Childshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14973808285834438472noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5729738823205484539.post-72317702804859504062012-03-26T21:31:50.339-06:002012-03-26T21:31:50.339-06:00Hey, Sam. Thanks. I do know that now (most of the ...Hey, Sam. Thanks. I do know that now (most of the time), which is why I get angry. Sometimes I want to scream, "This is not what he said and not what he did!!!! What the hell are you doing?!"<br /><br />But... that usually just gets you thrown out, so... :-)Jeannette Alteshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06574051760314762024noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5729738823205484539.post-12081475659947936152012-03-26T15:31:36.554-06:002012-03-26T15:31:36.554-06:00Hey, Tim. Thanks for the support. It makes me sad ...Hey, Tim. Thanks for the support. It makes me sad that this kind of thing drives people away from finding a family / community of believers to be a part of. But just like a biological family, if there is abuse, you need to walk away. <br /><br />I am so grateful that God helped me sort out that religion and doctrine and the Institutional Church were not him - He is separate, above, beyond all the man-made bs being peddled as his word.Jeannette Alteshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06574051760314762024noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5729738823205484539.post-74903278436245011242012-03-26T15:20:29.873-06:002012-03-26T15:20:29.873-06:00This is so harrowing and awful-what you are saying...This is so harrowing and awful-what you are saying in effect is that you were (are) suffering and then so-called helpers go and add more shit into the mix, under the guise of being 'good Christians'! Sheesh, no wonder you were going mad! Who wouldn't after all that?<br /><br />I didn't grow up 'churched' in any way and quite frankly when I read your testimony, and many others, I am bloody glad I didn't! It seems to me that some church groups attract the very people that outside the church we would call oddballs and freaks and the type of people we would very probably avoid like the plague!<br /><br />The first step to healing I think is acknowledging the problem; you've done that magnificently and admirably. In fact, I believe your story, your testimony, needs a much wider coverage to help countless others who've been abused in one way or the other. We need to understand that Jesus doesn't condemn people like you, He is reaching out; it's some of his 'followers' that I pity.<br /><br />Thanks for this post; it means a lot to me as I have struggled with severe depression myself all throughout my adult life, but I was never abused so I guess I was lucky.T-Childshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14973808285834438472noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5729738823205484539.post-75425128698200312802012-03-26T10:51:15.310-06:002012-03-26T10:51:15.310-06:00Just like a high quality cellphone will spawn doze...Just like a high quality cellphone will spawn dozens, if not hundreds of imitators and counterfeits, this also happens in religion. There is Jesus. There are those who follow Jesus. Then there are all of the religions that are something else. Unfortunately, some of them claim to be Christian.<br /><br />Jeanette, the religion in which you were involved was obviously a mixed up blend of who knows what. Run and stay away, But Jesus is the real deal. Unfortunately, it's easy for most people to throw out the genuine article with all the crappy fakes and imitations they find.<br /><br />Thankfully you are finding help with therapy. It takes awhile to overcome the lies we were taught about ourselves. That stuff is not from Jesus.Samnoreply@blogger.com